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In other companies, you can build a personal + professional goodwill by inventing things and making breakthroughs. At Apple, the brand encapsulates your achievements without anything to show for it. You're dust at the end of your career in exchange for a salary and a stack of non-disclosure agreements that expire on upon your death.


I think that's a pretty hardcore exaggeration. The last couple of times I talked to people from Apple (about getting a job there) they were pretty open about what they did and the tech they were using - and what they were looking for in terms of the person they wanted to hire. Unfortunately I wasn't quite the person they needed in either case. I came REALLY CLOSE last time, so I was sad to find out I still didn't have quite the amount of experience he wanted.

Oh well.


So, any of those Google, Amazon, Facebook guys that are famous for what they've done there, and/or have built "personal + professional goodwill"?

(And not after-the-fact hires of already famous people like Rob Pike, Dan Abramov, etc).


They said professional goodwill not fame. But Jeff Dean is famous for work he did for Google. Dave Cutler, Anders Hejlsberg, Jeff Bonwick, Bryan Cantrill, and Shigeru Miyamoto are famous for work they did for other famous companies.

People used to get famous working for Apple too. Jony Ive? Andy Hertzfeld? Susan Kare?


Good point and agree, its the same at other contemporary corporations. I am kind of looking at 1970-2000 era when companies used people as part of their brand / face - Bell Labs, Hewlett-Packard, Intel, Fairchild Semiconductor, IBM and many others that made great engineers feel-like they weren't replaceable, but actually part of the ethos of the company. Their personal goodwill was coupled with the company's image and success. We've stopped doing that I believe.


Yeah, ironically I think for Apple there's Jonathan Ive, which did rose to higher C-levels but was a mere designer in some Apple team in 1997.

For Google, dunno, maybe Yegge?


Google - I can think of Ray Kurzweil and Peter Norvig.


That would fit of the "after-the-fact hires of already famous people" I mentioned though -- not people becoming famous for what they did at Google.


Counter point: Chris Lattner.


He started LLVM before going to Apple. Likewise Michael Sweet created CUPS and went to work on it at Apple at some point.


The whole WebKit team is another example.

A lot of things are secret at Apple, others not so much




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